Comment by Peter jcp on December 5, 2012 at 10:19pm

Hi Lisa - I think this is a difficult subject to tackle - because I can see and have had the experienced both "sides of the fence" it terms of wealth and different governments in the UK.

I think you know I fairly "middle of the road" in terms of my politics - ie when younger at university a typical left winger wanting the state to pay for my education and tax the rich to the hilt etc.

Then 15 or so years later I was being invited to stand as Parliamentary Candidate for a right wing Conservative ( Tory / Republican) party- simply because I had wealth and was a successful businessman - working alongside a Billionaire etc etc.

As of today - I am still slightly right wing in terms of my UK politics and have not voted Labour or the Democrats for last three elections. However - I have also been a big Obama fan - simply because I believed the US needs free healthcare for everyone ( as in the UK and Europe) and some of the Republican policies and candidates were just to right wing for me.

With regards to incentives etc - the rich simply need to pay more than the poor - but not 80 or 90% of their earnings - but a realistic 40 -55%

Think about it which would you sooner be - 

a) a normal guy with a good job earning say $80-100k per annum paying say a net 25% tax and being left with say $60-80k net - or 

b) a successful businessman man earning over say a million dollars a year and paying say 50% tax ( yes double) and netting therefore only $500k per annum.

Yes for b its a hard life having to pay 50% tax and struggling on half a mill a year - yes life sucks lol

The key is hitting the right level. In the UK over 50 or 60% tax on rich - results in diminishing returns - less money in taxes - but under 50% more revenue for the state.

The US is soft and far too much tax avoidance for the wealthy - and that's coming from somebody who loves the wealth and would have no hesitation on paying my "fair" dues to society - as I have done in the past. 

In fact in the UK we have been naming and shaming tax dodgers - ( like your Republican candidate) they are no better than cheating bankers and business crooks.

It OK saying well they donate large sums to charity - that again is another word for tax dodge ;-)

With regards to government size and wasting money - yes more than likely the left will do more to create a bigger department etc for themselves.

However - yet again the key is "balance".

Any true great World economy needs free healthcare - social benefits and assistant for the old and the unemployed and the disabled.

The strong have to care for the weaker or less fortunate people - surely as a religious person you would always help your fellow citizen.

As normal - systems will get abused and that's why you need effect opposition to keep things balanced.

Believe me having worked with guys earning millions a year - they need keeping in check - as they will normally be the first too "bend" the rules.

These type of guys don't need incentives and lower taxes - they need being controlled and put in their place - greed is not good - it is a sin after all !!

Finally your government spend as gone up - but is still in line with other European countries in terms of a percentage of GDP.

Get those Republican candidates to pay the proper "fair" tax rates on some of their vast earnings and then - they might be looked at as proper alternatives and actually caring for their country - rather than just using it ;-))

Regards 

Peter

Comment by Lisa on December 5, 2012 at 10:56pm

The Politicians don’t "care" for the less fortunate.

The current administration is moving towards punishing charitable donations now.

The top 2% support over 80% of all charitable organizations ...

that are far more effective than governmental agencies.

They care only for power, keeping it and gaining more.

It’s not "fair" that the government is the middle man,...

taking from one man to give to another under compulsion.

If I did that, it would be considered thievery.

"Money is a living power that dies without its root."

The wealthiest in the US already do pay more taxes.

We need the Fair Tax.

Even if the current administration gets everything they want, ...

they won’t even come close to eliminating the government’s debt, ...

but they will annihilate our wealth production.

Comment by Holmes on December 5, 2012 at 11:02pm

Hello Lisa,

Excuse my intrusion but one cannot abide by some of the most popularized untruths and misinformed quotations and statements. One feels compelled to submit that the opener by author of above youtube video: "Money is the root of all evil" is totally distorted from the outset. This too often confused and misquoted paraphrase bears no resemblance to its origin and is often displayed in this manner. Youtube Author shows some understanding but cannot be taken and viewed passed the intro. Naturally this would lead the unwitting viewer in to thinking it was correct, simply because it is a familiar soundbite taken and misrepresented from a bygone era.

I table the following:

Timothy 6:10

The love of money is the root of all evil or παντων των κακων.

The Scripture does not say "Money is the root of no evil", nor is it an evil of any kind and thus above youtube video only reiterates that which we already know.

Best Regards,

Holmes.

Comment by Peter jcp on December 5, 2012 at 11:15pm

I appreciate your views etc - but surely your version of it not being fair for a "government" being a middle man etc - is just like going to a shop or a business to buy goods and services - ie you pay money for what ever you buy.

The UK government looks after our education, healthcare,policing and prisons,roads,sewage and refuge, disabled and defence etc etc.

The "fairness" is every 5 yrs maximum you get the chance to back them or vote them out

Competition is good - but not always can it compare with "state ownership" - as business need profits that sometimes compromise price and service, - ie in UK everyone complains about the railways and energy going outside state ownership and prices went up and service went down.

Remember - you can never have "Utopia"  - nobody can please everybody all the time.

Finally - two points -

1) yes - I agree your debt is extremely worrying - but after all those wars the US have been involved in - somebody has to pay the monetary cost - and yes I blame that on all the past administrations 

2) Life is not "fair" - and never will be - but we can try and make it fairer for all

Comment by Lisa on December 5, 2012 at 11:25pm

I suggest one listens to and studies the above.

Using the term “fair” one way and changing the meaning ...

gives with one hand & takes with the other.

Taxation is different than patronizing a private business.

I can’t spend my time educating on these basic truths.

This was a good video that Keith posted :

Comment by Peter jcp on December 5, 2012 at 11:36pm

Yes - all for free enterprise and even capitalism - after all I gained from it in the UK - but yet again it has to be controlled.

Can you imagine a society without Law and Order and Police. Similar with Capitalism - it has to be controlled - with rules and regulations - and again that word "balance"

Too many rules and regulations - and its restrictive.

Not enough and then greed and power would lead the world backwards to "slave" labour and more business rogues and crooks dictating

PS - Fair Tax is mightly flawed - but would take me ages to explain all the downsides - and I am off to bed now :-)

Regards 

Peter

Comment by Lisa on December 6, 2012 at 12:10am

Limited government is also not the same as no government.

Governments enslave, capitalists do not.

Good Night (-.-)  ZZZzzz

Comment by talisman on December 6, 2012 at 2:43am

that was an awesome video with milton friedman, i thank you for reposting it.

Comment by cristotrading on December 6, 2012 at 2:54am

republicans lost and democrats won. they need to get over it. other than that this should be a forex site "forexstreet.net" , political arguments with fundamental differences drive nowhere, pls write to your representative lol 

Comment by Lisa on December 6, 2012 at 3:21am

I thought it was a brilliant message too talisman and am glad Keith shared it with us.

I thought the news article out of the United Kingdom shed more light onto why, ...

for example, GFT left the US.

Same premise.

Their treasury lost over 7 billion pounds, it stands to reason we’ll lose much more ...

more than an election, which will in turn effect and affect everyone engaged in any market ...

and more specifically the currency market. 

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